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ASUS 4870 X2 or XFX 280 XXX Edition
Tone2b 
31/8/08 9:42:31 AM
Serf
Hi Everyone,

Interested in peoples thoughts on whether I should get the 4870X2 or the 280 XXX. I require one of these cards have a monitor that has a resolution on 1920 x 1080.

I like the 4870X2 as for the optimised games it runs them well, but I also like the 280 XXX as even though it is only a single GPU card, it runs games almost as well as the 4870X2, and even better where the 4870X2 doesn't scale. I have also seen that the 4870X2 does beat the 280 in Crysis at 1920x1080. Considering I am buying the new computer fo rthis reason, this sways me to the 4870X2. However before I spend the moolah, I am interested in peoples thoughts

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Cpt. Lock 
31/8/08 10:26:46 AM
Banned

If you give it time for crossfire drivers to mature for the HD4870x2 it'll beat the GTX280 in most tests.

As it stands now the GTX280 beats it in some tests where there's no crossfire optimization but that's more driver issues then anything else.

In terms of current cards it's pretty much 9800GTX+ > HD4850 > GTX260 > HD4870 > GTX280 > GTX280 SLI > HD4870x2

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elmo198 
31/8/08 10:36:17 AM
Champion

proud owner of an ATI 4870x2, best bang for bucks and have atleast a year or even little more longevity than gtx280 just cause it has directx 10.1 (not even sure what that means, lol)

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"I need a core2quad to read my email!"
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Cpt. Lock 
31/8/08 10:42:21 AM
Banned

nobody is really making directx 10 games let alone directx 10.1

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elmo198 
31/8/08 10:58:24 AM
Champion

exactly my point, just knowing is future proof is enough to warrant the purchase.

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"I need a core2quad to read my email!"
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Doctor Octopus 
31/8/08 11:10:19 AM
Master
There's no such thing as Future Proofing. You're a little deluded there. And Cpt Lock, you do realise that > means greater than, so basically you're saying the 9800GTX+ is better than the HD 4870 X2. And I know that's not what you intended, and if you look at it the other way around, it's still very wrong. The 9800GTX+ is slightly faster than the HD 4850, the GTX280 in SLI is quite a lot faster than the 4870 X2.

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"Make sure your answer uses Scripture, not logic." - The Christian Forums

Tone2b 
31/8/08 11:21:20 AM
Serf
The other thought to throw in the mix for NVIDIA is the use of CUDA and physics processing

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Cpt. Lock 
31/8/08 11:52:03 AM
Banned

Quote by Doctor Octopus
There's no such thing as Future Proofing. You're a little deluded there. And Cpt Lock, you do realise that > means greater than, so basically you're saying the 9800GTX+ is better than the HD 4870 X2. And I know that's not what you intended, and if you look at it the other way around, it's still very wrong. The 9800GTX+ is slightly faster than the HD 4850, the GTX280 in SLI is quite a lot faster than the 4870 X2.



It's an arrow not a greater than and if you look at reviews the 9800GTX+ shades the HD4850 in a few tests but not that many to count, and the HD4870x2 does quite a lot better then jkust about everything else in most tests.


Edited by Cpt. Lock: 31/8/2008 11:52:24 AM

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MyAlbanianAss 
31/8/08 7:21:41 PM
Guru

4870 x2.

NO FUCKEN QUESTIONS!

that is a serious video card.

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QX6700:GA-P35-DS3P:XFX9800GTX:4GB Crucial PC2-8500 Ballistix Tracer LED:3x146GB Cheetah SAS 15K.5 RAID0:2x1TB RAID1:
"I think Linux supports trinary."
http://www.zaimc.com - NEW MIX EPISODE 17! gogo

elmo198 
31/8/08 9:22:24 PM
Champion

there is such thing as future proof, be it one day or one month or one year, is still future proof. the 4870x2 is by far the fastest single card you can get. and is directx 10.1. and as of yet nothing is 10.1, so is fair to say is future proof. otherwise, why would it even mention 10.1 as advertising. is a gimmick to say we are still one step in front. I dont know about you. but that sounded alot like "we are future proof" to me. further more DDR5 I dont know but that is still leap years ahead of what nvidia has to offer atm. but to think the GTX280 in DDR5, now that would be something.

and honestly I'm just going to predict that future games arent going to get anything better in terms of eye candy. I think future games will be more focus on multi-threaded and multi-core task. modern PC hardwares already generate enough heat already. is about time software companys make use of the multi-thread and multi-core, b4 we all start having little nuclear reactors on our tables. And dont think they say say is vista friendly means multi-core friendly either. coz linux still by far way way ahead of windows apps in terms of multi-thread offloads.

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"I need a core2quad to read my email!"
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Tone2b 
31/8/08 9:42:52 PM
Serf
I think you can have some minor concept of future proofing in a PC, but only just and maybe only for a month. Taking it to a year may be a big ask. Nonetheless, I agree with elmo, I think future applications will use start to take more advanatge of multi core processors (graphics or otherwise) c.f. look at Nehalem. So I think it will be the 4870X2

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SceptreCore 
1/9/08 12:57:52 AM
Guru

Quote by Cpt. Lock
If you give it time for crossfire drivers to mature for the HD4870x2 it'll beat the GTX280 in most tests.

As it stands now the GTX280 beats it in some tests where there's no crossfire optimization but that's more driver issues then anything else.

In terms of current cards it's pretty much 9800GTX+ > HD4850 > GTX260 > HD4870 > GTX280 > GTX280 SLI > HD4870x2

Tri-SLI of GTX280 is the most powerful setup you can currently buy. No questions asked... no doubt about it!

However single card performance... the 4870X2 is yes the best!

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Doctor Octopus 
1/9/08 10:18:59 AM
Primarch
Quote by Cpt. Lock
As it stands now the GTX280 beats it in some tests where there's no crossfire optimization but that's more driver issues then anything else.



You might find that it's more of a gaming issue than anything else. The game needs to support Crossfire, and the drivers will optimise it for that.

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Quote by Midnight_light
What a waste of space that gemini is. It'd be more useful as a blunt weapon for hitting people who make such stupid things



Baner86 
1/9/08 11:18:03 AM
Hero
Champion


Depends how much you are paying man.

At MSY you are going to pay less than $550 for a GTX280 (this is probably a stock standard card) versus $650 for a HD4870X2.

The HD4870X2 will own the GTX280 considerably in most games EXCEPT for Crysis where a stock GTX280 is VERY similair to a HD4870X2 until of course you push the resolution to very high levels and turn on anti-aliasing where the HD4870X2 has a slight edge.

I'd argue that if you can get the XFX XXX edition (factory overclocked no doubt) for only a bit extra over a stock 280GTX then that would represent better value than a HD4870X2.

That's simply because the performance is guaranteed with the single GPU.

Owning an HD4870X2 myself you buy it as the "FASTEST VIDEO CARD" right...but it's honestly a little disheartening to go through your games turning everything up to maximum graphics, then you'll run into a couple of games with lacklustre crossfire performance and watch the game run worse than my old 2900XT's or 8800GT's.

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Q6600//GA-X38-DQ6//4x1GB ADATA DDR2-800//Hightech HD4870X2

E6600//P5B Deluxe WiFi-AP//2x1GB G.Skill DDR2-533//2x Palit 2900XT (Crossfire)

A64 4400+ x2//A8N-Sli Premium//2x1GB G.Skill DDR-400//2x XFX 8800GT (Sli)

Tone2b 
1/9/08 11:48:06 AM
Serf
Hey Banner, that is my one concern with the 4870x2, turing options down when optimisation doesn 't exist. However I have had a look at the performance of the 4870, and even there the performance isn't too bad. But your point sums up my dilemma! Further to this, the XXX is 699 (Scorptec), where the 4870 is between 650 - 725.

Ha

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Baner86 
1/9/08 11:59:27 AM
Hero
Champion


In that case if the XXX is $699 and I'm guessing you mean the HD4870X2 is between $650 and 725 (HD4870's shouldn't be anywhere near $400) then the HD4870X2 would own the GTX280 in value and performance in that case.

That is a ridiculous amount to charge for a factory overclock going by $545 stock GTX280's versus $699 for the XXX version.

Either find a place where they aren't charging through the roof for the XXX or if all XXX cards cost that much get the HD4870X2.

Just keep this in mind. Crossfire performance has ONLY GOTTEN BETTER since it began. It hasn't gotten worse and AMD/ATI would be stupid to let Crossfire performance worsen because it is an integral part of their plans for desktop video going forward.

They release a mid-range card (the HD4870), then clock it down for the low-end (HD4850) THEN they double the mid-range card EITHER on a single card (the HD4870X2) OR two HD4870's for the high end market.

So Ati MUST have good crossfire performance for the present and the future as their success depends on it. ALL their high-end options depend on Crossfire performance.

If you are willing to accept some games will run poorly with the HD4870X2 whilst the majority work absolutely blazingly fast then take the plunge and get one.

As most Ati users have known for a long time, you spend a lot of time hoping for driver fixes for game compatibility, especially older games or just improved performance but when they DO come it makes you happy you did buy the card in the first place.

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Q6600//GA-X38-DQ6//4x1GB ADATA DDR2-800//Hightech HD4870X2

E6600//P5B Deluxe WiFi-AP//2x1GB G.Skill DDR2-533//2x Palit 2900XT (Crossfire)

A64 4400+ x2//A8N-Sli Premium//2x1GB G.Skill DDR-400//2x XFX 8800GT (Sli)

Doctor Octopus 
1/9/08 12:13:36 PM
Primarch
Remember that you could always overclock it on your own.

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Quote by Midnight_light
What a waste of space that gemini is. It'd be more useful as a blunt weapon for hitting people who make such stupid things



MyAlbanianAss 
1/9/08 12:54:17 PM
Guru

4870x2.

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QX6700:GA-P35-DS3P:XFX9800GTX:4GB Crucial PC2-8500 Ballistix Tracer LED:3x146GB Cheetah SAS 15K.5 RAID0:2x1TB RAID1:
"I think Linux supports trinary."
http://www.zaimc.com - NEW MIX EPISODE 17! gogo

Doctor Octopus 
1/9/08 1:28:52 PM
Primarch
Quote by MyAlbanianAss
4870x2.



As if making 1 useless post wasn't enough?

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Quote by Midnight_light
What a waste of space that gemini is. It'd be more useful as a blunt weapon for hitting people who make such stupid things



Apocrypha 
1/9/08 1:29:22 PM
Master

Lol, why would anyone buy a card based on what it might do in the future with good drivers? Surely you'd think like this:

1. Drivers are hard to write and optimise, so they'll take time to release.
2. The graphics market moves so fast that we see generational leaps every year or so, which is pretty incredible.
3. NVidia and ATI are both planning on Q1-2 releases for new cards, either with new or updated architecture.
4. Corporate types that run these companies to make money will then order the driver teams to write drivers for the new cards.
5. We also see that driver support for cards is at best the length of the generation's lifespan -- 8800GTXs don't get many updates any more (besides PhysX, but that was planned).

So, um, I'll take the best performance I can get for my money now (not the best bang for buck necessarily, just the best I can afford) and if performance increases with driver updates, then great, that's a bonus. If not, I'm then not disappointed that whoever build my card is too busy with a better and newer one to care about mine...

Moral of the story: buy what's good now, not expecting any improvements. It would be silly to buy something for what it WILL/MIGHT do, not for what it actually DOES right now. They're graphics cards people, not shares or bonds.

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