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Website creation - What the hell am I doing?
orcone 
7/5/08 6:08:32 AM
Guru

I need an online portfolio, and I've decided to make the site myself.

That being said, I have no experience whatsoever with designing a website. I see CSS and Javascript and all sorts of other nonsense words and think "WTF?". I know they're coding languages essential for website creation though. Boo ya.

Now, for my question.
How? How do I go about learning the essentials? I've looked for some tutorials on how to code/slice/prepare etc, but have failed miserably. Surely there are some EXCELLENT tutorials out there for people in my situation?

And please don't say "Go to w3schools and learn". Even that place is way over my head.

A little background info to help give you an idea of my intelligence or lack thereof:
I've worked with graphics for a long time - mostly digital work for games and websites (banners, graphics, wallpapers etc) and the occasional print job on t-shirts. I know how to use the internet obviously, and I'm not 100% retarded as most clients are. At least I hope not.
This is a brand new field for me, and as expected I have no idea where to even begin.

Any help will be greatly appreciated to reach my final goal of a portfolio site. Would it be too much to ask for some guidance from some well known atomicans along the way? Monetary incentives will not be out of the question. (In before 200 serfs say "pm me for help thx".)

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I love Isa. She rawkz my cawkz. =o)

bignath99 
7/5/08 8:40:33 AM
Master

Without learning html, css, php etc. you could use an application
such as adobe dreamweaver, its not all that cheap though. im sure
there are alternatives, but even using such a program code knowladge helps alot and makes it a whole lot easier.

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superfireydave 
7/5/08 8:41:10 AM
Titan

You need html and css at the very least.
If you really want, pm me and I'll add you on msn or something.

edit: If you're good at graphics, do yourself a mockup - eg: what you want the site to look like, and then it should be a fairly simple process.


Edited by superfireydave: 7/5/2008 9:06:14 AM

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Mreow?

moofactory 
7/5/08 9:05:35 AM
Titan

No.. he doesnt, need to crawl before run.

This isnt someone wanting to lern web design, this is someone that wants a website to display his work.

He shouldnt have to become a web designer just to have this happen.
And I dont blame him for it going over his head.

It took me afew years to grasp some of the things I now know.

Some of us, while very creative with graphics can have an inability to comprehend code languages, Visual thinkers predominantly. Me being one of them, while im great with visual and pictorial problem solving, when it comes to language based issues I find it harder to get my head around.

I would suggest finding a web template or something pre made that wont take much to alter.

Just lern how to change text and insert images.

If anyone has any suggestions of pre made templates out there for him please do so. And or online GUI based web editors that are user friendly.

Something on par with how adobe contribute works in the sense of being able to edit a page without any html knowledge.

Im sure theres better ones out there than this but heres an idea:

http://www.tucows.com/preview/330447

http://www.download.com/Web-Page-Maker/3000-2048_4-10213459.html

http://www.creatingonline.com/webmaster/html_generator.htm

http://www.2serveu.net/free_website_generator.htm

http://www.wysiwygwebbuilder.com/

http://www.pablosoftwaresolutions.com/html/wysiwyg_web_builder.html

I know theres better stuff out there than this, maby someone else knows a good wysiwyg web builder.

I think for this perpose, a wysiwyg web builder isnt a bad idea.


Edited by moofactory: 7/5/2008 09:19:08 AM


Edited by moofactory: 7/5/2008 09:19:29 AM

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Quote by Ben Mansill
I've always waited for the day here when we talk about anal sex with animated Disney lions.

superfireydave 
7/5/08 9:26:13 AM
Titan

Quote by moofactory
No.. he doesnt, need to crawl before run.

This isnt someone wanting to lern web design, this is someone that wants a website to display his work.


I personally don't take any online presence really seriously if it isn't half decent done, but I guess I have standards.

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Mreow?

.:Cyb3rGlitch:. 
7/5/08 5:30:18 PM
Titan

Learn HTML, CSS and basic layout techniques:

1. http://www.w3schools.com/HTML/

2. http://www.w3schools.com/CSS/

3. http://www.subcide.com/tutorials/csslayout/

Shouldn't take more than a week to grasp the main ideas. I know you said "please don't say go to w3schools and learn", but if you take the time it's very easy. Just use notepad and save it as a .html file.

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Cyb3rGlitch Tutorials: http://www.cyb3rglitch.com/
Tutorials for the aspiring beginner.

superfireydave 
7/5/08 5:39:22 PM
Titan

As above: it's really not that hard.and as I mentioned before I'm happy to donate a bit of my time for a fellow EVE'er =P

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Mreow?

orcone 
8/5/08 3:23:50 AM
Guru

Thanks for the helpful responses all.

I'd like to stray away from a fully automated program, as I've heard they generate horrible code. But I'd be more than happy to use ImageReady to slice up a site and use its code. Speaking of code, when I said previously that I 'knew how to use the internet', I meant I know basic HTML and a little theory behind what makes a website.

I can change images and create links, but I don't know how to BUILD a damn site. Very hard to explain what I do know and what I don't, so I wouldn't be surprised if you are confused.

superfireydave - If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to add you to msn down the track if you'd be willing to answer questions such as "How do I make a repeating background image?" or "How do I make a portion of an image stretch to match the browser width?". Basic questions like that.

moo - Thanks for the links, I'll have a look into them. But as you said, I don't necessarily need to learn webdesign. But if I don't, I feel like I'll be at a disadvantage. It's something I'm inevitably going to have to pick up.
And if it's a skill I can learn and learn well on my own, then all the better.

cyberglitch - Alright you bastard, I'll hit w3schools up again. A few years ago I looked at the html section and that's where I learnt the basics. And when I say that, I mean I learnt how to post images in a forum and centre things. Not much else! But yes, I will look it over again. Thanks for the quick links.

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I love Isa. She rawkz my cawkz. =o)

orcone 
8/5/08 5:06:53 AM
Guru

Here's a concept I just worked up. Not exactly what I want to do, but close in terms of shape.

http://img397.imageshack.us/img397/1275/webpagecopyiv0.jpg

For a newb like myself, how hard would this be to create?

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I love Isa. She rawkz my cawkz. =o)

GTAV6 
8/5/08 10:26:52 AM
Hero
Titan


well, as far as 'constructing' the design you have there as a website, i personally believe it would be quite simple with only a basic grasp of xhtml and css.

i'll throw that together this afternoon as a basic layout for you to pick apart- it might give you an idea of what's involved.

and i'm also perfectly happy to lend a hand when you've got questions (although dave's a lot more accomplished than i am...). i'm on msn too, if it's convenient for you.

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+++ out of cheese error +++ melon melon melon +++ redo from start +++

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
http://www.thexman.net.nz/

superfireydave 
8/5/08 10:37:54 AM
Titan

That wouldn't be too hard at all, especially on standards compliant browsers.

Might take a bit of tweaking for IE perhaps, but other then that it's a fairly straight and simple layout.

Basically, xHTML is a way of encapsulating data into meaningful subsections. CSS is then a way of formatting those subsections so you can get something good looking :)

And GTAV6 is just being modest =P

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Mreow?

moofactory 
8/5/08 1:33:50 PM
Titan

Thats not too hard to code in xhtml and css.
Container div
headder div
image
nav div
<ul>
<li>About</li>
<li>portfolio</li>
<li>resume</li>
<li>contact me</li>
</ul>
content div
div 1
div 2
div 3
image
footer div
legal info

Thats how I see ur site marked up.
Then the CSS to style look and layout.

I wouldnt turn just to WC3 schools for learning css, Theres tons of better resources out there that are easyer to grasp.
If you have dreamweaver 8 or cs3. Use that so then atleast you can see what your doing as your going.


Edited by moofactory: 8/5/2008 1:38:37 PM

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Quote by Ben Mansill
I've always waited for the day here when we talk about anal sex with animated Disney lions.

GTAV6 
9/5/08 11:26:41 AM
Hero
Titan


here you go: http://www.thexman.net.nz/orcone/


please bear in mind that this is only how i would tackle this- it doesn't necessarily mean this is the best or most efficient way of doing it.

also, it doesn't work properly in ie6 - but for the point of the exercise, it was an issue i didn't think was worth fluffing around with (unless the final design was going to be a certainty).

it's hand-coded, so it won't make much sense in anything other than a text editor. it's also not a pixel-perfect recreation of your original design, as i took a few tiny liberties with a couple of dimensions for the sake of neatness and i didn't bother trying to match the font you used.


Edited by GTAV6: 9/5/2008 11:30:39 AM

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+++ out of cheese error +++ melon melon melon +++ redo from start +++

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
http://www.thexman.net.nz/

superfireydave 
9/5/08 11:40:10 AM
Titan

From the above, it's really easy to take that and chuck it into a content management system like MODx or even Wordpress if you didn't even want to touch the code.

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Mreow?

GTAV6 
9/5/08 11:46:26 AM
Hero
Titan


is it? awesome! i've never been certain how well my hand-coding integrates with a cms.

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+++ out of cheese error +++ melon melon melon +++ redo from start +++

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
http://www.thexman.net.nz/

Girvo 
9/5/08 11:55:05 AM
Immortal

MODx is stupidly easy to skin. :)

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[No Heroes] is the artistic antithesis of that sinking world; a thorn in the side of their beast. It's for those who move mountains one day at a time. It's for those who truly understand sacrifice. In our world of enemies, we will walk alone...

superfireydave 
9/5/08 1:51:52 PM
Titan

GTVA6 ->
Your MODx template would be like this
 
stuff here
<div id="content> <!-- my content div --> (taken from your layout)
[*-content-*] (or whatever the tag is for content)
</div>
other stuff here


It's really that simple =P

Wordpress is different, but it's essentially the same.

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Mreow?

orcone 
10/5/08 4:20:50 AM
Guru

Quote by GTAV6
here you go: http://www.thexman.net.nz/orcone/



Dude, that's awesome! Thank you very much! I'll have a look over the source code to see how you did it and match it up against what I'll be learning in a few days time.

Damn, how'd you make it so quick?

I had a look at it in IE, and you're correct in saying it's a little broken. Any reason as to why? Surely IE would be the most universal browser and able to decipher the code correctly?

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I love Isa. She rawkz my cawkz. =o)

Girvo 
10/5/08 8:00:31 AM
Immortal

Quote by orcone
Quote by GTAV6
here you go: http://www.thexman.net.nz/orcone/



Dude, that's awesome! Thank you very much! I'll have a look over the source code to see how you did it and match it up against what I'll be learning in a few days time.

Damn, how'd you make it so quick?

I had a look at it in IE, and you're correct in saying it's a little broken. Any reason as to why? Surely IE would be the most universal browser and able to decipher the code correctly?



BAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

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[No Heroes] is the artistic antithesis of that sinking world; a thorn in the side of their beast. It's for those who move mountains one day at a time. It's for those who truly understand sacrifice. In our world of enemies, we will walk alone...

GTAV6 
10/5/08 8:40:17 AM
Hero
Titan


Quote by orcone
Damn, how'd you make it so quick?


1, you'd already done half the job
2, i've done this sort of thing before
3, it's not a very complex layout (which is a good thing)


Quote by orcone
Surely IE would be the most universal browser and able to decipher the code correctly?


sadly, nothing could be further from reality. it stems back to when micro$oft thought they owned the internet and couldn't be bothered putting any effort towards making their browser meet any standards...

however, the broken bit in this case wouldn't be a major issue to get around. it just requires an extra bit of ie6-only css to 'correct' it. i was just too lazy to do it...

:o)




Edited by GTAV6: 10/5/2008 8:42:21 AM

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+++ out of cheese error +++ melon melon melon +++ redo from start +++

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
http://www.thexman.net.nz/

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